Are Children at Risk?
UPDATE (7/18/22): New information about the details of this incident is here: Children’s Safety: New Information — Not Overcome
UPDATE (7/21/22): Rock River Church has not corroborated the claims shared on 7/18. That claim by a pastor in the network remains unsubstantiated. Read More: Children’s Safety: No Confirmation from Rock River Church — Not Overcome
Is The Network failing to adequately protect children in its childcare programs?
I humbly ask that you read this entire post.
Trigger warnings: child sexual abuse; physical abuse of a child (in full audio), and mention of depression and resulting serious harm. If you are triggered by any of these things, be kind to yourself, take breaks if you need to.
I also ask that you extend grace to me. I’ve never had to write something like this. At some point in processing this, someone asked how I could protect myself. I said “it’s about protecting the kids.” That’s my stance, and I am firm in it, but I need your help. If I’ve been unclear or even wrong, please let me know. I am more nervous about this post than any other since my original letter. I can be reached at not.overcome@outlook.com.
I’ve tried to be as direct as I can, but there’s a lot to it that you need to understand, particularly if you are still in The Network, even more so if you have children in The Network. I have emailed this article to representatives of all three Network churches in the state of Texas. (View PDF of the email) I would be happy to post any statements they provide here or act on any corrections, clarifications, or additional information they provide.
UPDATE: I have not heard back from any of the representatives at those three churches. Today, I have emailed the Kids Directors (or general email) at all 26 Network churches. You can see that email here.
This is the kind of thing I’ve been worried about, ever since I started understanding abuse in The Network, and the lack of accountability toward the leadership. When I left Vista Church, I said the core of the issue was “church governance”, because there was no accountability. Without accountability, abuse can go unchecked, and leaders can make decisions that put people at risk. I hope and pray that the damage here is limited, but for those of you wondering why any of this matters, the below should be a wakeup call as The Network is playing with fire. Please. Please listen.
There are no fun cartoons in this post. No amusing YouTube videos. It’s not the time or place for that.
Draw your own conclusions
I am sharing literally all that I have. Any conclusions drawn are my own and only drawn from listening to the same audio you are listening to or documents you are reading. It is also informed by a general sense of The Network’s approach to sin, but that’s more of a supporting piece of data than primary. Please draw your own conclusions.
The only authoritative statement I will give is that, as near as I can tell, the audio is legit, but I also am not an expert in proving the legitimacy of such things. But there’s nothing in it that makes me doubt its authenticity.
On everything else, I’ve used words like “if this is what it looks like” throughout, but please assume that basically everything is predicated by that. Ask questions on the reddit, and I’ll do my best to answer, though there may be things where I have to respond with “I don’t know” (if I don’t) or “I can’t say” (where it would be relaying things I’m not at liberty to share).
The Audio
On Thursday afternoon, June 27th, 2019, Alex Dieckmann led a Breakout session titled “Healing from Emotional Hurts” at the Network Leadership Conference. Dieckmann had become the lead pastor at Rock River Church in San Marcos, Texas the previous year, planting that church out of Vine Church in Carbondale, Illinois. The Network Leadership Conference is held each summer. Those invited include all Pastors, Staff (including Kids Directors), Overseers, Small Group Leaders, and any spouses of those, across the entire Network. A few others are invited as well, typically people being eyed for potential leadership. The conference attendance is hundreds of people, and I find it hard to believe that any less than one hundred people would have been in attendance at this breakout session - again, these attendees would have included Pastors, Overseers, Kids Directors, and Small Group Leaders.
In the session, Dieckmann says the following, beginning at approximately 41:21 into the full teaching (in the cleaned audio below), which I will share at the end of this post. This clip itself is approximately two minutes and twenty-six seconds long (in the cleaned audio). I am presenting it first, prior to any commentary so that you may form your own opinions. I have literally zero information about this story beyond this. In listening to it, and the session, you now know as much as I do. Anything I write about it will only be sharing the research I have done and connecting dots with other observations about The Network.
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There's a woman who hadn't confessed something for her whole life. She was molested as a child. And then what happened was, because that happened, she did the same to someone else. And she carried such such shame with it. She was so embarrassed. She was so just scared all the time. And it left her in the space of feeling like she could not be herself. And she retreated. To like, "oh." And she would be around kids and serving in the Kids Program. She goes, "Oh, if only they knew. If only they knew." She could not hold a child without thinking back.
And she goes, "Oh, maybe if I'm a good mother. Maybe if I'm a good mother one day. Maybe if I do that, it would be able to make up for the wrong that I've done." She's dangling that stuff ahead of her. And she clings to that as an idol. She'll cling to things to be - to silence that accuser.
But you know what? She confessed that. She was so scared. I prayed for her and just prayed healing. And I was like, "Oh, you think you - you think you can give this to Jesus? Do you want to repent of it? Like you want nothing to do with it? You think you could forgive yourself?" Sure enough, by the end of the prayer, she had gotten to the spot where she felt like she could. She had confidence, she had courage to be able to do that.
Oh, she's not the same person. Like, like, I wonder. She would label herself as an introvert. But I'm like, "ooph, I don't know. I wonder if sin made you that way. I wonder if you've just retreated all these years." And I'm like, "Oh, six months from now?" I'm like, "Whooo!" I'm so anxious to see what happens. Why? Because she knows God's grace actually goes that deep. She knows that, "Oh, no, God is really that strong." She really believes that.
Report Made
I researched laws on mandatory reporting in Texas and consulted with the Texas Abuse Hotline. As near as I can tell, upon discovery of this, I was legally required to file a report within 48 hours. Therefore, I reported this audio to the Texas Abuse Hotline, and they have relayed it to the Department of Family and Protective Services in San Marcos, Texas.
My identity as the reporter would have been kept confidential by them, but obviously this post will strip me of that confidentiality.
DFPS is unable to give me any updates “due to confidentiality of persons involved.” I informed them that I intended to publish this audio publicly, and they did not tell me not to or issue guidance to do so (in fact, they never responded despite having responded quickly to prior emails). You can read the entire timeline at the end of this article.
Discussion and Analysis
I’m going to tread even more carefully than normal here, so there’s a lot of words, and I want to avoid jumping to more conclusions than is necessary. Again: Draw your own conclusions.
I will be telling you what this looks like to me, but I welcome alternative interpretations and, especially given the grievousness of what we are talking about, I really hope I’m wrong. I fully understand that this would damage my credibility going forward, but I hope people understand that I found this to be plausible and therefore actionable, and that the Texas Abuse Hotline advised similarly. I am erring on the side of protecting children, and if I’m wrong, then that’s fine.
All of this is predicated on Dieckmann having been truthful in this telling, and in certain spots, dependent on the woman having been truthful with Dieckmann. Though there is at least one effect of this that is bad even if Dieckmann had fabricated the entire story. Later in the full audio Dieckmann actually talks about having previously been deceitful in his life, so this is not beyond the realm of possibility.
People
We do not know the names of the people in the story, but I am going to refer to:
Jane Doe: The woman, who I will refer to as “Jane” or “Jane Doe” because this is the most common pseudonym used for women.
Sam Soe: The person Jane Doe “did the same to”, who I will refer to as “Sam” or “Sam Soe.” We do not know the gender of this person, and sadly there’s no common pseudonym for a person of unknown gender. “Sam” is a gender-neutral name (commonly short for either Samantha or Samuel). Sam is also Hebrew for “God hears”, which seems sadly appropriate, because I know that God has heard Sam’s cries and knows what happened to them. I will use gender neutral pronouns (they/them) for Sam.
The Story
I will quote a piece of the story at a time, and then comment on it. All of the words from my above transcription are present in this walkthrough.
“There's a woman who hadn't confessed something for her whole life. She was molested as a child.”
Jane Doe was molested as a child, according to Dieckmann’s account of what she told him. The grammar is ambiguous and we do not know how many times or how many people molested Jane.
“Hadn’t confessed something for her whole life” is important as well (and applies to the full story, which continues below), because it implies that no authorities were ever involved, or at least if they were, Jane never confessed.
We know nothing about the person(s) who molested Jane.
Here I want to say to Jane: What happened to you was wrong. Entirely wrong, and it should not have happened. I’m so, so sorry. I also wish that Dieckmann had offered to help you gain justice against your abuser if it was still possible. Any actions you did after you were abused do not negate your right to have justice done for what was done to you.
And then what happened was, because that happened…
Dieckmann tries to explain why she had done this, perhaps to make Jane’s behavior more understandable. But this is a myth, stereotype, and it’s at least mostly false. “children and teens who have been sexually abused are no more likely to become sexually abusive adults than children who have not experienced abuse” - StopItNow.org. I found some dispute to this that says that there’s some correlation, but it’s absolutely not universal. The fact that you were abused as a child does not mean you will grow up to be an abuser.
…she did the same to someone else.
Jane then “did the same” to Sam. The easiest interpretation of this is that Jane molested Sam, who was most likely a child (thus “did the same”). There’s additional evidence for this later that we’ll get to.
We do not know how old Jane was when she did this, or the precise age of Sam, and that would be an important piece of information, but again the easiest understanding of this is that Jane was significantly older than Sam, who is most easily interpreted to be a child - but none of this is certain.
And she carried such such shame with it. She was so embarrassed. She was so just scared all the time. And it left her in the space of feeling like she could not be herself. And she retreated.
Jane feels “shame”, “embarrassed”, “scared all the time”, and “could not be herself.” And as a result, she “retreated.” Dieckmann is naming all of these as being the problem he is trying to address. This is corroborated through the rest of the teaching in which the focus is all on us being able to not feel guilt and shame for things that have happened in our past. The problem is that Jane feels these things, not what was done to her or what she had done. I see his statements focusing on the impact of what she had done more than what happened to her, but it’s somewhat ambiguous.
To like, "oh." And she would be around kids and serving in the Kids Program.
First, I can’t for the life of me figure out what the “To like, ‘oh.’” is there for. Dieckmann uses those words frequently throughout his teaching, so my guess is that he was planning to lead into some quote, but then realized he needed some context so stopped himself. Listen and see what you think.
This is clear and unambiguous: whatever church this happened at (it’s most readily understood to be Rock River, corroboration is later) had Jane serving in the Kids Program. Unless Dieckmann’s words are wildly misleading or false, Rock River Church had a woman who had molested a child in its Kids Program. This is unsafe due to the potential for repeat offense (which is not universal, but it’s why churches do background checks on people who work with children), though at this time it sounds like the church would have had no way of knowing that the woman had this in her past. So they’re not responsible for not having known, but they are responsible for what they do about it.
She goes, "Oh, if only they knew. If only they knew." She could not hold a child without thinking back.
The punctuation is ambiguous here and it’s possible that the end quotation mark should be after “back.” But it sounds to me like Dieckmann switches back to his own voice prior to that, and so I’ve placed the quotation mark where I think he meant it, but it’s hard to tell. Listen to the audio and see what you think.
This is the first corroborating statement that Sam was a child. Jane is unable to “hold a child without thinking back.” This is different than if she had felt uncomfortable being touched (what you might expect from a sexual abuse victim). So again, this makes me think that the flashbacks described here are induced by what Jane did to Sam, not what was done to Jane. And the trigger is to “hold a child.” That adds support for the interpretation that Sam was a child, and Jane was at least significantly older, if not an adult.
By the way, note that Alex Dieckmann is using Network Pastor Voice throughout this teaching, and applying emotional tones to it.
And she goes, "Oh, maybe if I'm a good mother. Maybe if I'm a good mother one day. Maybe if I do that, it would be able to make up for the wrong that I've done." She's dangling that stuff ahead of her. And she clings to that as an idol. She'll cling to things to be - to silence that accuser.
First, I find it likely that Dieckmann’s quote of Jane is not a direct quote, but a paraphrase. The lead in of “Oh” is the same as several other spots in this story (and throughout the teaching), and the rest just sounds far more like his words than someone else’s. Dieckmann’s talk is on “Healing from Emotional Hurts”, and here he seems to just be talking about that - how can we help Jane not feel shame for what she did. But then he finishes with “to silence that accuser.” This matches the language seen by Landon Nagata in MBT Session 2, where he talks about accusations of sin coming from the “accuser” (in his case he would have nightmares about getting drunk, but almost certainly had been drinking prior to that, thus the dreams were stress about doing something he knew was wrong). Similarly, if Jane really did molest Sam, then this is not something coming from “that accuser.” This is something coming from a conscience that knows “the wrong that I’ve done” as Dieckmann quotes her as saying.
But you know what?
The turn of the story - where Dieckmann starts seeing light at the end of the tunnel.
She confessed that. She was so scared. I prayed for her and just prayed healing. And I was like, "Oh, you think you - you think you can give this to Jesus? Do you want to repent of it? Like you want nothing to do with it? You think you could forgive yourself?"
By using language of “repent” and “forgive”, Dieckmann is validating that he thought this was wrong, but he’s casting hope, seeing if she would be able to forgive herself for it and “give this to Jesus.” The fact that Dieckmann thought it was wrong implies that there isn’t some misinterpretation in which the woman had actually done nothing wrong.
And… what about Sam? What about their healing?
Sure enough, by the end of the prayer, she had gotten to the spot where she felt like she could. She had confidence, she had courage to be able to do that.
Dieckmann states that Jane was able to do as he suggested. And this was borne out of “courage.”
Let me state the obvious of what should have happened at this point, assuming that this is what it looks like: Dieckmann should have informed the woman that he is a mandated reporter (if this is happening in Texas. I have not looked up the laws elsewhere), and that while there is grace in Jesus, we have laws, and Dieckmann is legally required to report this to authorities. When I have seen therapists they have let me know that confidentiality with them only applies if I don’t tell them I’ve committed a crime or one has been done to me (there are a few other exceptions, too). Christians want to live in grace, and we do. But that also means facing justice for things we’ve done, not hiding from it. Living in the light is living with integrity. And remember - Sam is still out there at this point (and hopefully still is today). Jane could almost certainly bring significant healing to Sam by turning herself in, and letting justice be done. (More on that below).
But Dieckmann never states that this is what happens, and instead all of his ministry is focused on Jane’s healing.
Oh, she's not the same person.
Dieckmann starts celebrating the change in Jane, moving past any accountability, and pronouncing her to be “not the same person.” Dieckmann’s major in college was Exercise Science (he says so later in the teaching). Is he capable of assessing the risk of repeat offense by someone? It should be obvious, he does not. His lack of expertise in psychology actually makes this whole training (on “Healing from Emotional Hurts”) problematic, but that’s a whole other topic for another day. But here, it means he has no right to hold his own opinion of the woman above due process.
Like, like, I wonder. She would label herself as an introvert. But I'm like, "ooph, I don't know. I wonder if sin made you that way. I wonder if you've just retreated all these years."
He seems to say that sin made her an introvert, which I find to potentially be problematic judging of introversion. But later in the teaching he seems to also have a problem with an extrovert, so I’m not sure what to make of both of those things. Either way, this is nowhere near the biggest concern here.
And I'm like, "Oh, six months from now?" I'm like, "Whooo!" I'm so anxious to see what happens. Why? Because she knows God's grace actually goes that deep. She knows that, "Oh, no, God is really that strong." She really believes that.
And that’s it - he’s “anxious to see what happens.” The “six months from now” statement is what makes it highly likely that this all happened at Rock River Church in San Marcos, Texas, where Alex Dieckmann is Lead Pastor. He seemed excited to witness Jane’s future. It’s also worth noting that he begins the story with “There’s a woman” not “There was a woman”. Is it possible it happened somewhere else? Maybe, but the wording would be strange in that case.
At this point, the story ends, and Dieckmann:
Has not stated that he has reported this to anyone, as he would be legally required to do if the story is what it sounds like it is.
Has not removed Jane from working in the Kids Program or as a child-care worker at Small Group (its unclear if she ever did that) and informed parents that she should not be serving as a babysitter (normal actions for a church with someone in their community who has previously sexually abused a child).
It would also be reasonable for DFPS to interview parents and children Jane had worked with to determine if she had acted inappropriately toward any of them.
In the rest of the teaching, Dieckmann gives multiple stories of someone feeling guilt or shame over their past sins. In all cases the answer appears to be confession, prayer, and internal healing. Restitution or reparation toward those damaged by sin is simply not discussed as being relevant. This again makes it seem plausible that Dieckmann never reported this or took other actions, which is why I am publishing this.
I hope I’m wrong, but the risk to children was too great to not publish this.
Problems
There are at least five potential problems here. I am leading with the one that is certainly true, regardless of whether or not Dieckmann’s story is true. The rest are no less severe, but I cannot say for certain that they are valid.
Definite Problem: Dangerous Teaching on Handling of Abuse
Abuse should be reported when either of the following two things happens:
A person witnesses it directly
A person observes credible evidence of it having occurred
In The Network, I have never seen any policy on reporting abuse in either of those cases. It does not appear to be in:
The Small Group Leader trainings (via Leaving the Network) (there is a brief note on childcare in the logistics checklist in Part 2 “Leading the Small Group Meeting”)
The Series (not even in the “Freedom” session, which includes guidance on how to hear confessions, but no notes on what to do if a crime is confessed)
Side note, but consistent with this whole teaching: Section II on “The Problem with Sin” completely fails to talk about how our sin affects other people.
The bylaws (via Leaving the Network)
There are also no policies around reporting abuse in any of the following documents (only a statement that the church may report if necessary):
Blue Sky Kids Worker Application
PDF Capture of it as it appeared on June 17, 2022 around 9:35AM Pacific Time. (including this in case Blue Sky Church moves or removes the application from their website).
Document: Blue Sky Childcare Policies (Received by my wife in this email dated August 21, 2014 which has additional information.).
The email also notes that the small group leader who was sending it had previously forgotten to have the new child-care workers fill this out. Those child-care workers had been watching the kids in this small group since March 26, 2014, meaning they were not sent this email until they’d been doing child-care for nearly four months. The Small Group Leader implies that he had not gone over the policy sheet with them either.
“It's more about making sure we have good centralized records than anything else.” - This shows a bias toward protecting the church rather than protecting the kids. Consider the contrast with saying something like “We do this to ensure the safety of children across the church.”
UPDATE: I have done a deeper discussion and shared more documents in a follow-up post here: Childcare Policies. Please read that when done with this post.
UPDATE #2: I have also shared the policies of a non-Network church here: Non-Network Childcare Policies
There’s a lot I could say about these policies, mostly about what’s missing, but I will save that for a follow-up blog post (feel free to make observations on the reddit!). Note that these documents are collectively problematic even if the story Dieckmann shared is entirely false.
This is not acceptable. Two things are minimally required:
Report to the proper authorities.
Ensure that the suspected abuser does not have access to children.
Dieckmann does not indicate that he does either of those, and then makes it worse, because he tells this story to a room full of leaders. This makes this effectively part of the leaders training, and he fails to tell them that they have a responsibility to report and safeguard the church if they hear something like this. He is effectively saying “pray for them and see if that helps them get over it.”
Churches, schools, and corporations (if well run) spend significant time and effort training employees and volunteers the right ways to handle situations like this. Why?
First, it’s just the right thing to do. Sam is a real person, who sounds like they were sexually abused by Jane. They’re out there. And they deserve someone standing up for them. Jane, like anyone, needs to be held accountable for her actions, according to the laws of the land. A church does not get to suspend those laws just because they don’t like them (more on that in a minute for a case where Sándor Paull nearly certainly did exactly this). This is the entire point of mandated reporter laws (which we will cover in a moment). If Jane is held accountable, she could also get professional mental health services, not just Alex Dieckmann praying for her. And Jane could be a risk for others.
Second, the church should protect itself. The church (and Network, since this was taught at the Network Leadership Conference) could potentially be sued and held liable for this. Many churches are being sued these days for having enabled or covered for abusers. When I spoke with the Texas Abuse Hotline they told me of a church in which many employees knew, and did nothing, and those employees were now also being held liable.
I hope and pray that others forgot this story as quickly as I did, and that this teaching did not feed an environment in which abuse would go unchecked, like the Catholic Church and Southern Baptist Convention, among so many others.
Those of you with children - if you knew that the school you sent your kids to was this inattentive to ensuring your children’s safety, what would you do?
Note that the #MeToo movement began in 2017, and was closely followed by #ChurchToo. This was a huge deal in churches across the country. Why has The Network not put together a comprehensive safeguarding program? They are leaving kids at risk, and leaving themselves open to potentially massive liability. Why? Will they do so now? Organizations like GRACE partner with churches to implement safeguarding systems and investigate current issues if needed - does The Network believe they are so much better that they do not require expert input? If so, why?
I pray that their procedures (or lack their of) have not resulted in victims (over and above the seemingly rampant spiritual abuse that has already been well documented.).
Personal Story
I want to add a personal story here. When I was at Blue Sky Church in Bellevue, WA, I was in Chris Miller’s (leads Worship for the entire Network) small group for a time spanning 2012-2013.
At one point, a person in the group (for anonymity, we’ll call them “Blake”, a gender neutral name, and use pronouns they/them) was paying far more attention to our small child than would be expected. In fact, Blake seemed to pay more attention to our child than the other adults in the room at times (I am leaving intentionally leaving out details - my child has no memory of this due to age, and I’d like to keep it that way).
This made my wife and I uncomfortable, and another regular attendee of the small group fully agreed with our appraisal (to be honest, I’m not sure who broached the conversation - myself or the other attendee). I spoke with Miller about it and he also agreed and promised that he would address it. Blake was first asked to leave our child alone, and then failed to do so in a following week. The timeline is sketchy, and you’ll see why that matters in a moment. I believe I brought it up with the other attendee and with Miller (rather than them bringing it up with me), but I can’t say for sure. After this, Blake was asked to find a new small group, and did. I saw Blake around the church at times after that, but never around our child.
At the time I was appreciative that Miller had taken care of the immediate concern, though a nagging thought had me concerned about whether or not Blake was still interacting with children. I simply trusted Miller to ensure their safety.
I have checked and I have no emails with Miller on this - if I recall correctly it was entirely handled via text (old SMS, no records) and phone calls, perhaps some in person conversation as well. I do not recall if I ever discussed this with anyone other than the other attendee and Miller.
Why it matters
While the situation at hand was resolved, my wife and I were never asked to file a report or given an opportunity to, and I’m unaware of the church having kept any records of this situation. This is dangerous because it means that any future similar instances in which Blake behaved similarly could still be seen as a “first time” type thing, particularly if Chris Miller moved on to another church (as he did in 2017 when he helped plant Joshua Church in Austin, TX). My entire confidence that Blake was not potentially behaving similarly (or worse) was predicated on hoping that other parents would also be vigilant and Chris Miller keeping watch. Beyond that, I simply felt uncomfortable asking for anything else.
As it is, I’m unable to give a firm recounting of the details precisely because no record exists and it was now over eight years ago. There’s parts I remember clearly, there’s parts that I remember less clearly.
In fact, the recent report on sexual harassment at Christianity Today highlighted exactly this institutional failure, as HR failed to keep records on disparate reports, and therefore failed to connect the dots. This allowed the harassment to continue much longer than it should have (it persisted for 12 years). Please note the maturity of Christianity Today’s response when they finally realized that something was wrong - they worked with an independent investigator instead of investigating themselves. They were widely praised for this, including by victim advocate Rachael Denhollander.
What happens next with Blake?
I will email Blue Sky Church offering them Blake’s identity and being willing to share additional details so that they are aware. I also recommend that they reach out to Chris Miller for details.
I have no evidence that abuse occurred, so will not be reporting anything about Blake to authorities in the State of Washington. I also would not expect Blue Sky Church to make public the identity or actions of Blake, but rather keep a report on file, the same as they do with accident reports.
Possible Problem: No Justice for Sam
It appears as though (but is not certain) Dieckmann heard Jane confess that she committed a crime (child sexual abuse) for which she had never been held accountable. Reporting this could allow justice to be served for Sam. The statute of limitations on this in Texas is quite long - it looks like it’s when the victim turns 18, plus 15 years (sometimes longer). So if Sam is under 33, there’s still time. My nightmare is if the statute of limitations expired between when Dieckmann heard the confession and now (e.g., if Sam is 34 now, but was 31 in June 2019).
Victims deserve justice. This is biblical. (Proverbs 31:9, among other relevant passages)
Open your mouth, judge righteously,
defend the rights of the poor and needy.
Job 31 also speaks of Job’s obligation to help those less fortunate than himself (that if he had not, it would have been worthy of God’s wrath - See Timothy Keller’s book Generous Justice for more)
Just this week, The Southern Baptist Convention (SBC) finally passed a resolution acknowledging that those brave survivors who were trying to hold them accountable for so many years were telling the truth the entire time. The first major article on the abuses there came in 2019, and survivors had been reporting it for decades before that. That’s all so long to make them wait. If this is what it looks like, Dieckmann has made Sam wait three years longer, which is even more problematic when you realize that abuse victims are significantly more likely to suffer issues like depression and even suicide or other deaths of despair (drugs, alcohol, etc). That’s why abuse victims who are still alive are called survivors, because some of them don’t (hat tip to the excellent movie Spotlight for explaining this as it covers the scandal of abuse by Catholic Priests). If this audio really is what it looks like it could be, then Sam deserves justice now. God has heard their cry. Will anyone else?
Sam: if this is all true, and if some how you are out there reading this (I don’t even know how), I’m so sorry. What happened to you should not have, and you’ve waited too long for justice. If all this is what it looks like, I pray that your wait will soon be over and that you can heal.
A couple of relevant recent tweets about the SBC:
Possible Problem: No Justice for Jane
Jane is a victim here too, though in this case there’s much less to go on. But it’s possible that Dieckmann could have helped her gain justice. He also should have referred her to a Licensed Mental Health Professional (not James Chidester, due to the conflict of interest), not assumed that his prayer was enough to heal her wounds caused by what happened to her and what she did.
Possible Problem: Failure to Report
Alex Dieckmann (among others) may have committed a crime (I am not a lawyer). In the state of Texas, failure to report sexual abuse of a child is a crime, potentially punishable by fines and jail time. Clergy are not exempt from mandated reporter laws in Texas. Failure to report is not a small deal. It’s a very, very big deal. If this story is what it looks like, and Dieckmann didn’t report it (which he didn’t say that he did), then this may be legally actionable (yes, I’m using “if” and “may” a lot here - falsely reporting something is also a big deal, and I want to stay far away from that, while also sharing what I have found in my research).
But it gets worse. What other leaders were in the room (even from the state of Texas), listened to the audio, or had previously heard the story from Alex Dieckmann? Joshua Church and Christland Church had both been planted, which means that Network Leaders like Steve Morgan (President), Sándor Paull (said to be Vice President), James Chidester (on payroll as psychological support for Network Pastors) would have all lived in Texas. Did any of them know? Which of them heard Dieckmann tell this story at Network Leadership Conference, or listened to the audio afterwards. Paull is Dieckmann’s Area Coach (supervisor of sorts; he identifies Paull in the full teaching), and I believe this is the first time Dieckmann would have been teaching at an event like this. Paull may have listened to the audio to provide feedback, right? Or might have been in the room? And does Steve Morgan listen to all of the audio from these events? Or did Dieckmann consult with Paull over whether or not to report this to begin with? And did Paull talk with Morgan? Did any of them talk with Chidester? What about the Kids Directors? And how many Worship Leaders, Staff, Small Group Leaders, Pastors, or spouses heard Dieckmann tell this story. How many of them live in Texas and failed to report it themselves? I felt sick when I realized I might have heard it. The only thing I have to go on is that I have absolutely no memory of it in any way. But Dieckmann can’t claim that - he’s the one who said it.
Possible: Leaving Children at Risk
We do not know if Jane Doe was removed from her position serving in the Kids Program, but Dieckmann does not say that she was. If she was left in that position, then she would still have access to children. Not only that, but families in the church may see her as a potential babysitter or childcare worker at small group (At which childcare workers are frequently working alone, unsupervised and out of view of any adults). Does she do childcare for any of the small groups?
By the way, if you’re struggling to understand the gravity of all of this because Jane is a woman, try replacing “Jane” with “John” and see if it makes a difference. Imagine this is what Dieckmann had said:
There's a man who hadn't confessed something for his whole life. He was molested as a child. And then what happened was, because that happened, he did the same to someone else. And he carried such such shame with it. He was so embarrassed. He was so just scared all the time. And it left him in the space of feeling like he could not be himself. And he retreated. To like, "oh." And he would be around kids and serving in the Kids Program. He goes, "Oh, if only they knew. If only they knew." He could not hold a child without thinking back.
Does that sound worse? Is that only because your mental image of a child sex abuser is a man and not a woman? Women can do this too. It’s certainly rarer, but it’s not like women cannot do this.
If this story is what it looks like it could be, Jane should have been removed from serving in Kids Program, and parents should have been made aware that they should not have her watching their kids. This isn’t to shame Jane. In fact, Jane should still be a full participant in the church, welcomed by all, and the pastor should make her aware of what’s happening (all of this subject to what happens after Dieckmann makes the proper report to authorities).
Also, if Jane left, and went to another church, it may be wise for Dieckmann to contact that church to inform them of what he knew. Though again, reporting it to the proper authorities is necessary and should take care of safeguarding for that.
I’m begging you to take this seriously — I can’t tell you how many stories there are of abusers not being held accountable, and then offending again, and again, and again, all because some other church leaders failed to hold the abuser accountable. Read “What is a Girl Worth?” by Rachael Denhollandar. It’s about taking down Larry Nassar, who abused over 200 women and girls in his time as a doctor, particularly for USA Gymnastics. And it’d been reported the first time something like 10-15 years before they finally stopped him. I legit cried at the end when I realized just how much work Denhollander and so many other survivors had to put in to stop him, and how many survivors Nassar never should have even had access to if only leaders had believed survivors earlier.
What can you do?
Some things you can do if you are in The Network, and you can do some of them today:
“If you see something, say something.” If you have knowledge of the abuse (sexual or otherwise) of a child in a church, please look up the procedure for making appropriate reports, even if it was long ago. In many states, lawmakers have recently moved to expand the statute of limitations, and in some cases make an exemption from it for a year or two, so time may be of the essence.
Contact your pastor or Kids Director and ask them to send you their written policies and trainings on reporting abuse.
Ask them to show proof that leaders and those working with kids in the church have been educated on those policies and agreed to them.
If they only do items (2) and (3) because of this article, ask yourself why.
Educate yourself on best practices for safeguarding in churches. You have every right to expect that these best practices are followed in your church.
Send this article to others in The Network, particularly parents. They have a right to know how their kids are being protected.
If at Rock River, ask Dieckmann for either proof that he reported the incident or proof of why it was unnecessary. Potentially find out if Jane is serving in the Kids Program (only relevant if the story is as I have interpreted it)
I am not an expert, this is just me talking as a parent: I would recommend that parents not place their kids in childcare at Rock River Church until clarity is reached (and an email from Dieckmann saying “Jeff Irwin’s report is entirely false” is not clarity - I’ve reported nothing but his words and Network documents).
If at Rock River do not take vigilante action against Jane, even if somehow you think you know who she is. Act with grace toward her. See item (7) for the proper next step.
If you have further information about this incident (e.g., if Dieckmann shared it elsewhere with more details):
Contact the Texas Abuse Hotline or San Marcus DFPS. Please do this, even if your information proves that no crimes were committed. I want truth here, and if Jane and Dieckmann did nothing wrong, they deserve to have that known and I will be excited to publish a follow-up stating exactly that.
Do not report first or only to leadership at Rock River Church. I can’t tell you how many stories I’ve heard now of people who reported abuse to church leadership only to have it swept under the rug as leaders said “ok, we’ll take it from here.” Call the Texas Abuse Hotline first.
You can contact me: If it helps clarify or dispel anything here, please let me know, and I’ll be happy to publish updates as I learn more, or corrections if I have reported anything that was incorrect (note, further information will not result in corrections but rather future stories - I’ll only correct this story if it turns out that I was incorrect about what was said and when). Please note, again, please contact the Texas Abuse Hotline first. I am not the proper authorities. I also make no commitment to publishing I hear - particularly if there’s no evidence backing it. I published this article because the audio is unmistakably Alex Dieckmann, and easily traced to a particular time and place, and myself, my wife, or Leaving the Network can vouch for the authenticity of all documents shared.
Because Spiritual Abuse lays the groundwork for Sexual Abuse and Financial Abuse, or just because Spiritual Abuse is wrong and tremendously damaging in its own right, demand that The Network contract with GRACE (or an organization that GRACE endorses) to investigate all of the claims made here, on Leaving the Network, and on the reddit. Please do this before it is too late, or there are more victims. The SBC report on Sexual Abuse that came out in May was so awful for one reason: it showed that the victims had been telling the truth the whole time. False reports of abuse are rare. Very rare. We’re not making this stuff up. I speak because I want the harm to stop, and I certainly don’t want it to get worse. Accountability and safeguarding need to be a priority, now.
Timeline
I want to first share where this audio came from, and what steps I have already taken.
Specific Dates
Hearing the Teaching: June 27th, 2019
I was at the 2019 Network Leadership Conference and believe (though cannot say for sure) that I was in this session. I have absolutely no recollection of this story. I don’t know if I was zoned out, heard it but did not recognize it for what it was, or if I wasn’t there.
Receiving the audio: Sunday, May 1st, 2022
I received the audio for this session and other Network teachings on May 1st, 2022. I will not disclose how many teachings or of what type. The person I received it from did not know that this story was in it, nor did I. It was just a set of audio for potential future review and publishing. I also will not disclose from whom I received the audio.
Listening to the audio: Wednesday, May 18th, 2022
On the night of Wednesday, May 18th, I was listening to the audio because I remembered one of the pastors saying something in one of the Breakout sessions at this conference that bothered me and I was looking for that, mostly out of curiosity. When I heard this story, I immediately re-listened to it, because of what I thought I had heard. I talked with my wife to tell her what I thought I’d heard, and process it with her.
First call to Texas Abuse Hotline: Thursday, May 19th, 2022
On Thursday, May 19th, I was traveling to the RESTORE conference, and started researching mandating reporting laws in the state of Texas. Thursday night, from my hotel room in Elgin, Illinois (near Chicago), I called the Texas Abuse Hotline and spoke with a woman. This first night, I was just asking her if they found it relevant, and I read her a rough transcription of it, without telling her who was involved or where, or giving her my name. Hearing my description, she did say it was worth reporting, and that my making a report would be, “in good faith.” In Texas, you can be prosecuted for making false reports of abuse. As near as I can tell, Texas mandates that anyone who is aware of abuse must report it within 48 hours. She did say that if I failed to report, it could leave me legally liable if abuse was occurring and recounted a case where that had happened. I told the woman on the abuse hotline that I needed a day to consider my options.
Second Call: Making the Report: Friday, May 20th, 2022
The following day, Friday, May 20th, I was at RESTORE, and I called the Texas Abuse Hotline again (within 48 hours of hearing the audio) that night to report what I had heard. This time I spoke with a man. I was insistent that he note in the report that no one should contact Alex Dieckmann without reaching out to me in order to receive the actual audio, since I was simply relaying what I had heard. I made the report because I found it plausible to believe that a woman (Jane Doe) who had previously molested a child (Sam Soe) had not been reported by Dieckmann, and that Jane may even still be serving in Kids’ Program or otherwise have access to children either at Rock River Church or somewhere else. Not only that, but it’s possible that the molestation Dieckmann says that she admitted to may still be within statute of limitations (see above in), so there could be a victim out there who has never been able to get justice. And there is even a chance of getting justice for the molestation that was done to Jane as well.
Protecting children is of utmost importance, and I heard no sign in the audio that they had been protected sufficiently.
Sending the Audio: Monday, May 23rd, 2022
After receiving my report from the Texas Abuse Hotline, someone from The Department of Family and Protective Services (DFPS) in San Marcos, Texas reached out to me on Monday, May 23rd, and I responded by sending them the full audio of the session and noting the timestamp at which the story begins.
Confirmed Receipt: Friday, May 27th, 2022
I confirmed with DFPS on Friday, May 27th, that they had received the audio.
Learning There Would Be No Updates, Asking if I Could Share Publicly: Friday, June 3rd, 2022
After I inquired for updates, DFPS responded on Friday, June 3rd that I would not receive any further updates “due to confidentiality of persons involved.”
Also on June 3rd, I I inquired about whether or not I could share the audio publicly, given its relevance to other churches.
Inquiring Again, Informing of My Intent to Publish: Friday, June 10th, 2022
Having heard no reply, I inquired again on Friday, June 10th, stating that if I did not hear back by the end of the day on Wednesday, June 15th, 2022 I assume that I could release the audio. It was important to me to give DFPS the opportunity to do their jobs and investigate as needed, but I also believe this audio is something people have a right to hear. I am not in a position to deny people that right.
Publishing: Friday, June 17th, 2022
I am publishing this article on Friday, June 17th, 2022, after having not heard back from DFPS. I wanted to publish yesterday, June 16th, but the writing wasn’t ready and this is too sensitive to get wrong (I did not start writing until the 15th, hoping that DFPS would get back to me). This morning was spent gathering the various documents on child-care policies in The Network, and making final edits. I also decided this morning to share the story about Blake.
I do not know if anyone in The Network has been contacted about this at this time.
I understand that some may be upset that I did not release it earlier, but I was attempting to assist local DFPS as much as I possibly could, and I am not an expert in such things.
Who already knows
I typically do not share drafts or lengthy details about what I will be posting here with others (my wife is an exception to this). I believe the independent nature of the various truth-telling efforts regarding The Network adds tremendous value, because, unlike The Network, there is no structure of control that forces the same message to come from many actors. However, particularly because I wanted second opinions, I told select individuals about this audio after I reported it to the Texas Abuse Hotline. I believe at least one of them has prepared their own response which may come quickly after I publish this. I shared the draft of this article only with my wife (not implying she is a co-signer of it, she has not reviewed the materials nearly to the depth that I have).
In addition to this, there were other reasons for sharing it. I consider these people to be friends (though I was not close with any of them before leaving The Network) and I needed people to talk to about this as I walked through it. Finding this audio added significant stress, mostly driven by the reality that the churches may be unsafe places for children. It also raised about how The Network may respond to my reporting this and making it public. There’s only so many people who understand this, and I leaned on them.
I also had reason to believe that one or more of the people that I told also already had access to this audio, and I wanted them to be aware of what they may be in possession of and for them to know that it had already been reported to DFPS.
If there are additional reasons for sharing it, I will not disclose those here.
Disclaimers
Audio Editing
As always, I have applied a noise filter and EQ to the audio for clarity. The clip shared initially is a fully uncut portion of the audio. Because of the sensitivity of this topic, I’m taking the step of here also providing the original audio as I received it, with no edits made.
Transcription
As always, I am using otter.ai for the base transcription, and then manually editing it. It is best efforts, and the transcript is not authoritative. But I have scrubbed the transcript for the clip above more attentively than most that I share, because of the sensitivity of it. There are a couple places where the punctuation or quotation marks are ambiguous in Dieckmann’s speech, but I’m unaware of any where it would change the meaning. Again - please listen to the audio.
For the full teaching below, I’ve done my normal efforts on transcription - it’s mostly good, but undoubtedly still some errors, particularly in punctuation are spots where Dieckmann speaks quickly and is hard to understand. As always, the audio is the authoritative copy.
Full Teaching
For the benefit of full context, here is the full, uncut teaching.
Cleaned Audio
The relevant clip starts around the 41:21 mark (depending on how you read the lead-in to it).
Original Audio
This is the exact audio I received. In this case, the recording quality was quite good, so they’re quite similar.
I use Audacity for file editing, and for some reason, it looks like Audacity is ever-so-slightly slowing the audio, so my cleaned version is 1:34:19, while this one is 1:33:53. If anyone knows why, please let me know, but this is one reason I’m sharing the specific original audio, so that you can listen to it exactly as recorded. The relevant clip should be at somewhere around 41 minutes in.
What comes next?
I honestly do not know. For those of you who pray, I ask that you join me in praying for Jane and Sam, pray that there are no additional victims in The Network, and pray that the Network Leadership handles this well and partners with a third party to get its safeguarding processes up to what’s needed. For those of you who can take action and influence for this, I encourage you to do so.
Read Next: Childcare Policies (new post on Tuesday, June 21st, going deeper into policies in the Network and sharing additional documents).